Patty: Most books about how to have a good marriage or a good relationship are so romantic. Living with someone isn't all that romantic. When you're loading the dishwasher, you're not starry-eyed.

Roz: They're romantic. Sometimes they're very, very serious. It's not like these fights aren't serious. They are, but they're just much more -- the things that my husband and I will have fights about, they're not really about -- recently, my husband got quite angry at me because I put the raspberries on the lower shelf as opposed to the top shelf where, evidently, raspberries belong in some sort of ideal universe. I was just amazed that he took that so personally.